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Less Is More Horsemanship Forum
Welcome to the Less Is More Forum. This forum is to post questions, comments, suggestions, ideas, principles, concepts and ideas regarding Natural Horsemanship and more importantly, the philosophy of "Less IS More". This is a place where like-minded people can come to throw away all the old traditional ways of training, and riding, and begin to experience a new FREEDOM in their relationship with their equine partners. Whether your goal is to learn more about natural horsemanship, get support for your own personal Less Is More belief, find solutions for problems that are hindering your relationship, begin a journey of discovery or healing, this is your home. Regardless of what the current "fads" are in traditional circles or natural horsemanship circles, I encourage you to think 'outside the box'. Feel free to post a message.
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| Viewing Page 1 of 1 (Total Posts: 5) |
| Author | Comment |
Lisa Phillips
Jul 19, 07 - 11:32 PM |
turn out
Michael, I have a question for you. I see a neighbor of mine down the road and they leave a horse alone in their round pen for most of a day, maybe up to several days at a time, keeping him separated from the other 2 horses they have. He can easily see the others wherever they are on their property and I've never seen him looking worried or pacing, or anything when I go by. He is usually just standing there. It reminded me to ask you -- do you have Hondo turned out with your mares, turned out in close proximity, or what right now? How do you personally handle that with a new horse and what is your opinion on that? How have you handled it with Hondo? I realize there are times that keeping a new horse separated from the others for a period of time is good for health reasons, to make sure they aren't bringing an illness into the herd, etc, but just wondered if there are folks who believe it is a good idea to do that to perhaps enhance or accelerate the bond the horse achieves with his human partner. I don't really have an opinion on the subject, I've never used that tactic before, my horses are all turned out together all the time, but I seem to recall hearing some folks (not necessarily on this board) saying they do this. Would love to hear what other people's thoughts and practices are regarding this. |
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Michael Gonzalez
Jul 20th, 2007 - 6:06 AM |
Re: turn out
Good question... Currently Hondo is seperated and in a large barn lot/corral with access to the underside of my barn and a lean-to. The other horses come to visit him through the fence. Originally we did this to be able to ensure that we could catch him and work with him. For the past two weeks I have been taking Hondo out on lead to feed in the pasture. We are slowly getting his digestive system used to the super rich pasture that we have here. To go from hay to rich pasture is hard so we started with 30 minutes at a time and are now up to 45-60 minutes a day. I plan on turning him loose on the pasture this coming weekend. I introduced the other horses one at a time in the corral. I start with the lowest in the herd. I brought her in and left them in the corral/barn lot together over night. They had to share the same hay and water. The next evening, I replaced her with the next highest in the herd and kept her in there overnight. My problem is my lead mare Desi. She is a rather unfair lead mare. It is "Do it my way and you wont get kicked" way around her. I have known some very fair mares but Desi is a pure Spaniard with a hot temper. For a little horse, she will stand her ground and belt it out with any horse regardless of size. When she was a little 2 y/o she was part of a 14 horse herd. She took on two big drafts and traded shot for shot with them! She then spun adn ran broadside into the biggest one's neck with her teeth bared and that was it, she was lead b**ch !!! Yesterday evening while I was letting him feed, she decided to try to give him both back barrels, I saw her loading up and was able to difuse it. That behavior is fine and normal within the herd, but never ever when humans are present. I ran her off form all of us in the herd eating quietly together. I would not allow her to come back in. Anyway...so that is how we slowly integrate Hondo into the herd and into the pasture. We will also give Hondo a probiotic when he makes his final transition onto grass full time. Just to give him a helping hand. We are looking for an adoptive home for Hondo. As it stands right now, there have been a lot of recent changes within the rules of the Makeoever Challenge and I am very seriously considering backing out of the competition. I will not waiver. I can offer Hondo for adoption for the BLM as if I am a foster home. I would rather adopt him out than to take him back. If anyone has mustangs or is interested in a mustang, please remember that Hondo is up for adoption. The BLM adoption fee is $200. If he goes to the adoption site, they auction them off and he could go for much much higher. Anyone interested in Hondo needs to email me or post your interest here along with your email. This is really heart-breaking and my family is becoming distraught at the thought of losing HOndo, but we have no choice at this point. It is a long story and once the final decision has been made, I will post all the reasons why we are backing out. Michael |
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Lisa Phillips
Jul 20th, 2007 - 7:47 AM |
Re: turn out
Michael Thank you so very much for your reply. Do you ever separate horses in the same fashion in order to accelerate their bond with you? Perhaps this horse that I see down the road has some difficult health issues or something. I really don't know them very well but if I ever happen by when they are out I might ask. Again, I sure understand separation for health reasons, or protecting the safety and sanity of certain lower ranking herd members, I was also curious to see if anyone does it for bonding enhancement or acceleration. I am absolutely HEARTBROKEN to learn of your situation with Hondo. What if you could be the highest bidder? You know I'll be there. I've been longing to meet you for years. Would you want to interview me as a possible adoption candidate? I am having fencing projects performed on my property as we speak, literally! I want to do it to faciltate better pasture rotation practices but I also want to do it to possibly add another horse or two to my family in the coming years. If you believe I would be a solution or part of a solution as you consider this difficult decision, please let me know. But here is what I think. I think you need to do whatever it is that will keep Hondo with you. He deserves that and so do you. If BLM doesn't offer anything to you that makes that an option, I'll gladly help you in this matter any way I can. Please keep us posted on this. Again, I think I speak for most if not all of us when I say, we all believe you would very likely win the competition; however, it would not surprise me in the least for you to pull out if it meant getting to adopt Hondo. That is the man of character and integrity I've come to know you to be. If you choose to pull out and adopt him you have my full support. I would love to see you compete and win, but horsemanship is not a competition! I know you signed up for this BLM thing as a way to share your philosophy and your wisdom. You didn't do it lured by prize money and fame! So don't fear doing the right thing if it means keeping Hondo! We'll be proud of you, not disappointed that you didn't go to competition! Let us know how we can help. 
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Felicia
Jul 21st, 2007 - 10:27 AM |
Re: turn out
I think it is kind of selfish to sperate a horse so he will bond faster. He is the one who then has to be alone 23 hours out of the day, when he could be playing with his friends. You should be the most interesting part of his day, but while he is with his friends. I know a trainer who always seperates horses, and she tells people it's because they bond faster. But once she starts working a horse, she can't turn them loose because they won't come back. Instantly immposible to catch. She has told me I am not working my horses hard enough, because they run TO me when they see the halter, not FROM me. So I think that is just a nice handy excuse to keep a horse, who maybe doesn't want to work with you, around. But seperating is obviously necessary with a new horse, to watch for sickness and get used to grass etc. But that is differant then seperating for training. |
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Michael Gonzalez
Jul 22nd, 2007 - 10:05 AM |
Re: turn out
HI Gang... I never separate horses for bonding purposes. People who do that are thinking in humanistic terms and are doing it for themselves instead of the horse. Let's face a true fact here...regardless of how much we love our horse...regardless of how much we think (or know) our horse loves us...we can never ever replace what they mentally, emotionally and physically get from being with other horses!!! Period!!! They learn more in 5 minutes with the herd than they learn in the remaining 23:55 hours with the human. Separating them is selfish. They are afraid that they cant catch their horse. If they were truly kind, loving and feeling for the horse, the horse would respond in kind regardless if they were in a round pen, stall, paddock, or out in a million acre preserve. Let me tell you what has happened this weekend... I have been introducing Hondo out with the mares a little each day. Keeping him online and letting him graze 30 minutes or so with the mares. Getting his digestive system used to our rich pasture. Yesterday I finally led him out with the mares and took the halter off and walked away. I jumped on my old '51 Ford 8N and began mowing the pasture all around them. He fed right alongside his mares and never spooked. He walked when they walked and trotted when they trotted. After mowing for an hour or so I walked up to him and put his halter back on...walked him back to the corral, and separated him. About an hour later, I walked him back out and turned him loose again. I then went back an hour later...caught him and led him to another part of the pasture and turned him loose where therer was some nice tall grass. In this way, he begins to see that just because I catch him doesn't mean I will separate him or work him... When horses run away, it is because they are usually caught...tied....quickly groomed...put in a round pen and run in endless mind-numbing circles...worked...tied...groomed...put away.... People then begin to leave halters on them...why? Because they cant be caught...people leave halters on so they can walk slowly up to the horse and SNATCH the halter and clip the lead on them. This causes the horses to become headshy and not want the human to walk up to them. You would think after all these years people would learn...but look out in any given pasture and you will see horses wearing halters 24/7. Next time you see this just know that there is a hole in the human's training and a hole in the relationship. This is one of the reasons why on all my leads (with the exception of a few old ones laying around the barn) there are no snaps or clips. We tie our leads on. There is no way yo can snatch a halter and tie a lead on with a horse who wants to run away. This means you have to be quiet and slow and have a good foundation with your horse so they will allow you to come in, adn then stand quietly for you to halter and tie the lead rope on. Let me suggest to all of you to begin to remove your snaps. Learn to tie your leads on and begin beuilding that slow relationship with your horse. Michael |
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